@kdfrawg the interesting thing is that the pop culture feminist narrative is that as men we need to argue with these guys pretty much constantly. and obviously i do. but i realised that most of those guys just don't even listen. and they get really angry and hostile and crazy if a man challenges them! it's almost quite funny, except that you know it's completely ineffective. anyway i think a difference can be made with people who have the potential to go one way or another depending on guidance. but also, i find i can influence people i'm close to but definitely not strangers